bioval bbb

[Brian McIlmoyle]

Originally Posted by Blackthorne

So here is my question. Probably silly, and I have read both threads, but I think I am missing something.

Who needs a biodgradable BB?

Seems to be a required attribute in Europe.

[Beazer]

Judging by Easy' timing and posts on this forum, it would be extremely easy to conclude that he is a rep/VIP in the Bioval heirarchy.

I'm all for these BB's IF they are what the manufacture/company states, however if they are proven to cause physical damage/injury then anyone using these against me would find themselves in a very small box.

Here's a huge issue that hasn't arisen yet.
We all know there are some asshats in airsoft? I can be one from time to time
Anyways...

Honesty is huge in airsoft and I find it disturbing that this company(or even its carrier!) which obviously has had this issue arise before did not first find the largest airsoft forum in Canada(ASC) and be there for any questions or concerns. Making a post stating that they are considering entering the market, and clearing the air about their product. Providing substantial proof that negates these window incidents, and not having the community doing the work for them.
They would have been better recieved for sure and Scarecrow nor I would be extremely suspicious of their intent.
It's about Honesty and I just am not getting that vibe.

[Drake]

Originally Posted by Brian McIlmoyle

Seems to be a required attribute in Europe.

And despite that a number of fields have banned the Biovals.

[Azathoth]

Originally Posted by Drake

And despite that a number of fields have banned the Biovals.

Of course they are banned in some fields, they are certainly hard enough to shatter glass bottles and windshields. If you had a field unbroken windows then you should ban the use of these BBs. Their are also Glass BB's that are being used as counterfeit product, (see the BBBmax thread that was recently locked) not to mention the huge amount of disinformation on the internet.

[AngelusNex]

Originally Posted by Azathoth

Of course they are banned in some fields, they are certainly hard enough to shatter glass bottles and windshields. If you had a field unbroken windows then you should ban the use of these BBs. Their are also Glass BB's that are being used as counterfeit product, (see the BBBmax thread that was recently locked) not to mention the huge amount of disinformation on the internet.

well yes, that's what the interwebz is for i guess.

[Blackthorne]

Originally Posted by Brian McIlmoyle

Seems to be a required attribute in Europe.

Ahh..OK. I was just trying to see whats driving the conversation.


I just find it funny that they have restrictions on BB's (even with EU's fuel efficiency regulations) when they probably dump multiple thousands of times more carbon into the air just driving from game to game.

Plus, I haven't seen anything here on the carbon footprint of the manufacturing process. From a full environmental impact POV, there is even less on the web from that company.

[Easy]

I think there is a need to clarify here:

(1) The bb in question is the BIOVAL BBBMAX.
(2) The rest of BIOVAL BBB products are made of normal bioplasticand are no harder than normal plastic. In fact in many cases they are softer.

BIOVAL BBBMAX - Is a transparent bb, seemingly harder than normal bbs. Has been banned on fields with props containing windows, such as vehicles and buildings. Which accounts for the sum total of 1% or less of European fields and mainly in Belgium (3 of 5 fields). Most private fields and teams that play on public property with special permits use them regularly.

HARD bbs - these same fields have banned all the harder "metal" type bbs for the same reason. Digicons for example.

BIOVAL BBB 0.20g, 0.23g, 0.25g, 0.30g are of the soft biodegradable plastic and they have not been banned anywhere.

BIODEGRADABLE and EUROPE - The political atmosphere towards airsoft, paintball and (yes) laser tag in EUROPE is such that private players and fields are adopting every possible measure to make these "controversial" sports more palatable to a sceptical public and legislators who are ready and willing to use any means possible to ban these sports. Biodegradable removes the decades long objection that airsoft players are dumping tons of plastic on public and private land all over the continent. This offers legislators a chance to gain some votes by restricting and banning the sport. In many areas private fields must respect environmental laws as though they were public land in order to protect indigenous flora and fauna which is not private property (from a legal point of view).

SWITZELAND - passed a recent law (December 2008) making "replica" guns (including airsoft, paintball and even plastic toy guns that shoot absolutely nothing) the legal equivalent of real guns. This means special license to import, export, sell, mediate, manufacture and/or modify. No retail sales to foreigners is alowed. Bio bbs are self imposed to placate the legislative urge further restrictions in playing.

ITALY - Paintball is illegal because authoritise think "terrorists" (lol) or rioters can fill the balls with caustic soda and shoot at police. Airsoft is in the crosshairs as we speak. But a right wing government is in power and this seems unlikely for now. Vehicle and buildings are illegal on Italian airsoft game fields because the athorities believe this can be used as a means of training at a para military level. This is a very grave accusation.

GERMANY - after a recent school shooting German legislators are at this moment discussing a new law that would ban paintball, lasertag and some believe airsoft.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/europe/8041320.stm

This incident has hit every desk of every legislator the world over. Surely, including Ottawa!

Are there contradictions? Of course:

SWITZERLAND – anyone can walk into a gun shop and with a simple ID can buy our national rifle (SG550 in 5.56mm) semi auto only, a smooth bore shot gun (not pump), and single action (no magazine) rifle and ammunition and take them home. No problem no restrictions. Pistols require a simple procedure and CHF20 fee and maybe a wait of a couple of weeks for the purchase permit. As long as your record is clean and you are over 18 you will most likely get one. Most males also have their Army issue full auto rifle or pistol at home and are called to practice shooting every so often. There are also an estimated 10 million small arms (most likely a lot more!) in private hands completely undeclared to the police.

ITALY – As long as you are 18 or over you may apply for a license and buy a pistol without any real restrictions. Just a little bureaucratic headache designed to deter those faint of heart. In spite of this millions of people have weapons of every type. Italy’s IPSC is the second most successful federation outside the USA and hunting is a huge business.

GERMANY – The German hunting community is huge and this business is extremely important to the economy of many towns especially in the south in the foothills of the Alps.

The continent is rife with pollution and our autostrada / autobahn / motorway / autoroute speed limits are between 120kmh to “unlimited”, further contributing to CO2 emissions and pollution in general. But airsoft game fields are cleaning up their act with bio bbs in order to placate a hypocritical political community and (in many respects) general public.

The fight to play this sport is the same all over. Biodegradability is a personal choice or a rule impossed by private fields.

Only Italy, it seems, actually has laws in this sense. If you cannot prove the bbs you use are bio then you will get a fine of €250 for litering ... even in private forests. lol.

[AngelusNex]

Shit, Italy sucks....

[Blackthorne]

Oh great. It's more of the community cow-towing to the public in a lame attempt to make everyone happy all the time.

That sucks.

[Scarecrow]

... next thing their going to ban is exhalation because it contributes to the greenhouse effect by emitting Co2.

Everyone hold your breath for the next, uh, thousand years...

[coach]

Originally Posted by Scarecrow

... next thing their going to ban is exhalation because it contributes to the greenhouse effect by emitting Co2.

Everyone hold your breath for the next, uh, thousand years...

That might be a good thing. We'll all die and turn into compost which will promote vegetation growth which will turn CO2 into O2.

[talon]

Originally Posted by Azathoth

Of course they are banned in some fields, they are certainly hard enough to shatter glass bottles and windshields. If you had a field unbroken windows then you should ban the use of these BBs. Their are also Glass BB's that are being used as counterfeit product, (see the BBBmax thread that was recently locked) not to mention the huge amount of disinformation on the internet.

shattering windows seems rather dramatic, but shattering bottles and glasses is nothing to an airsoft gun. i've shot through bottles with airsoft pistols all the time, generally thinking that it wouldn't be possible.

[pjosephsmith]

just saying what i use. i use the evike "matrix" kind. (.20s and .25s) and i have not had a problem or a excelled quality out of them. i would rate them as a medium grade, i guess. but hey i se what people like and imma gonna get some basterd's .22s. thanks

[Scarecrow]

Originally Posted by talon

shattering windows seems rather dramatic, but shattering bottles and glasses is nothing to an airsoft gun. i've shot through bottles with airsoft pistols all the time, generally thinking that it wouldn't be possible.

Well, pistols are a different thing all together because the gas pressure changes with ambient temperature and that can change velocity and GBBs can really crank out the FPS. I think most of the time people on this topic are talking about AEGs...

[AngelusNex]

Originally Posted by Scarecrow

Well, pistols are a different thing all together because the gas pressure changes with ambient temperature and that can change velocity and GBBs can really crank out the FPS. I think most of the time people on this topic are talking about AEGs...

I shot threw a beer bottle My brother was holding once with a lightly upgraded TM aeg firing 330 fps at about 30 feet (long story), first 3-4 bbs bounced then it shattered.




And the whole bioval breaking windshields.... well, swing a pick axe at a car windshield and then you'll realize biovals shattering them is impossible. Plain glass (old glass in houses and such) Is simple for any bb to break/damage with a short burst.



EDIT: anybody else see 2 site supporter tags under scarecrows Avatar??