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mthaynes · May 31st, 2006, 11:13

Hello Folks

If you look up my posts you will see that we have been producing a machined alloy box for some time now. Although out tests of the PGC are VERY premature at this time we do have some notes that you may wish to consider. That said of course I am extremely biased to my own design so you should not consider me impartial. In any case following are initial findings on our test unit.

1.Integrated hop claims to improve FPS however the results posted do not support it. We have done tests with a deepfire 135 spring in a 6 MilSpec box and shot 465 with .25’s with .20’s that would be 515. (.5 = 50 fps).

2. Integrated hop has a high probability of feeding issues. The 1 piece hop in your gun floats on a spring. If you sick a screwdriver between your gearbox and hop you will note that the hop can move back and forth a bit. This ensures that the hop will align with the mag. By fixing the hop position you lose this flexibility. If your mags fit lose in your mag well no problem, however if you have a tight fit you could have issues.

3. The gear box is a copy of the ICS gearbox. It even incorporates a spring release mechanism. In short I think we all know how well the ICS performs …….

4. The system includes a head and nozzle. We have not been able to test to see if a bore up will fit properly. Since a bore up is 5k thou larger in diameter this could be an issue

5. It is in no way as strong as the 6 MilSpec box The rear spine uses a screw to fit the cylinder brace. (side note with out the brace it reminds me of an m14 gearbox). The structural integrity of the spine is therefore limited to the screw thread. In my gearbox the spine is machined as part of the casing for strength. It also does not use a fluted design like mine which also increases strength.

6. The tail cap design is potentially week – we have not finished testing on this yet

7. The 6 MilSpec box made several changes to the gears position in relation to the piston. The design ensures that all these parts maintain alignment. In the two part ICS system we have seen alignment issues between the piston & tappet and the sector gear. We expect the PGC to inherit the same issues.

8. The bearings supplied with the PGC gearbox are very cheap. They are a level 1 bearing. We use a level 3 to level 5 in our newest designs. A level 5 is 6 times the cost of a level 1. The Black 6 MilSpec box includes $30 worth of bearings at my cost.

9. It is clear from folks investigation that the PGC unit preferences the Hurricane body. We partially believe this to be related to note 2 above. The 6 MilSpec box is field proven in the Hurricane, Systema, G&P, Guarder, and CA. At this time we are unaware of any body that the box does not fit in.

10. The PGC will only fit in the m16 receiver. The 6 MilSpec box was designed as a Version 2 replacement so it will fit in the g3 / mp5 family of receivers with some modification.

That said yes at $250 we are more expensive. Part of that is due to cheaper machining costs in Asia. But as we all have learned in Airsoft - you don’t get something for nothing.

May 31st, 2006, 11:13	#7
mthaynes Trader rating Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: Southern NH, USA	Hello Folks If you look up my posts you will see that we have been producing a machined alloy box for some time now. Although out tests of the PGC are VERY premature at this time we do have some notes that you may wish to consider. That said of course I am extremely biased to my own design so you should not consider me impartial. In any case following are initial findings on our test unit. 1.Integrated hop claims to improve FPS however the results posted do not support it. We have done tests with a deepfire 135 spring in a 6 MilSpec box and shot 465 with .25’s with .20’s that would be 515. (.5 = 50 fps). 2. Integrated hop has a high probability of feeding issues. The 1 piece hop in your gun floats on a spring. If you sick a screwdriver between your gearbox and hop you will note that the hop can move back and forth a bit. This ensures that the hop will align with the mag. By fixing the hop position you lose this flexibility. If your mags fit lose in your mag well no problem, however if you have a tight fit you could have issues. 3. The gear box is a copy of the ICS gearbox. It even incorporates a spring release mechanism. In short I think we all know how well the ICS performs ……. 4. The system includes a head and nozzle. We have not been able to test to see if a bore up will fit properly. Since a bore up is 5k thou larger in diameter this could be an issue 5. It is in no way as strong as the 6 MilSpec box The rear spine uses a screw to fit the cylinder brace. (side note with out the brace it reminds me of an m14 gearbox). The structural integrity of the spine is therefore limited to the screw thread. In my gearbox the spine is machined as part of the casing for strength. It also does not use a fluted design like mine which also increases strength. 6. The tail cap design is potentially week – we have not finished testing on this yet 7. The 6 MilSpec box made several changes to the gears position in relation to the piston. The design ensures that all these parts maintain alignment. In the two part ICS system we have seen alignment issues between the piston & tappet and the sector gear. We expect the PGC to inherit the same issues. 8. The bearings supplied with the PGC gearbox are very cheap. They are a level 1 bearing. We use a level 3 to level 5 in our newest designs. A level 5 is 6 times the cost of a level 1. The Black 6 MilSpec box includes $30 worth of bearings at my cost. 9. It is clear from folks investigation that the PGC unit preferences the Hurricane body. We partially believe this to be related to note 2 above. The 6 MilSpec box is field proven in the Hurricane, Systema, G&P, Guarder, and CA. At this time we are unaware of any body that the box does not fit in. 10. The PGC will only fit in the m16 receiver. The 6 MilSpec box was designed as a Version 2 replacement so it will fit in the g3 / mp5 family of receivers with some modification. That said yes at $250 we are more expensive. Part of that is due to cheaper machining costs in Asia. But as we all have learned in Airsoft - you don’t get something for nothing.