Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Red Deer
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OMNI VII is where "filmless" first appears, as well as "thin-filmed". It is the These tubes that are labelled as "gen 4"
Taken from my post on edmontonairsoft
Quote:
Posting this as a request from the previous night game. This will answer commonly asked question that you see here and on our national board ASC.
Q: I found a used pair of NV on sale from "X" place should I buy it?
A: General answer is no. Rule number one of buying NV. Don't buy used unless you know the supplier and can get your money back. If you read further on, you will see about the life span of the tubes etc. Their is no way you can test the remaining life of a tube without destroying the tube.
Q: I have "X" money to spend what should I buy.
A: Simple answer it's your money, you can do what you want with it. Long answer, If you are trying to look operator as fuck buy a dummy PVS14 / GPNVG from a Chinese airsoft site, ebay, or airsoft retailer. Some of them are functional using close circuit television camera's use smart watch displays on the inside. They range from 200-700 dollars. For a "quality QCd" in the USA one you are looking in the 300-450 USD mark. If you want functional NVG then go check out the NIGHT VISION GENERATION COMPARSION as it shows you in pictures what each generation can do under realistic tactical conditions. Also link HIGH END DIGITAL NIGHT VISION VS HIGH END IMAGE INTENSIFER NIGHT VISION you can see the difference between multi-thousand dollar digital NV vs image intensifier systems.
Q: OK seriously I have $500.00 What do I buy?
A: Get a Surefire flashlight, they run 80-150 dollars new depending on where you buy them from and you will be far getter off than any kind of NV you can possibly spend in the <2,000 range. DO NOT buy flashlights that are not military or tactical grade unless you are a flashlight modder. This means DO NOT BUY FENIX, KLARUS, ****FIRE lights unless you are a lumen head modder.
Q: Seriously dude, listen to me I have 500-600 dollars what do I buy
A: On a super tight budget you use a Sightmark ghost hunter 1x24 which is a Gen 1 unit. It looks like a PVS-15, and with some hardware store screws, a dremel, JB weld, and some chinese grade clone mounting hardware, and some time you can helmet mount them. In some cases it's better than nothing. Guides are available on youtube.
Q: What about thermal?
A: What about it? Hunting thermal and the iphone / cell phone clip on systems are currently not suitable for tactical use. They do not have the range, sensitivity, shock/water proof, weapon or helmet mountable, on screen refresh rate.... Entry level systems run 8,000 USD which is much more than Gen 3 NVG, and they are very poor compared to military grade units which cost upwards of 20,000 dollars. Having used these units to hunt, and varmint on the farm, I would rather use NVG than thermal. Their is no way to aim with a thermal device.
Q: How long does the NVD last?
A: Depending on the generation and the technology: Short answer
Gen 0: ~500 hrs
Gen 1: ~500 hrs
Gen 2: ~5,000 hrs
Gen 3: 20,000 - 30,000 hrs
Gen "4" FLAG: 1,000 - 2,000 hrs
Long answer: depends if its auto-gated and how much light the unit is exposed to. Gen 3 Tubes use a gallium arsenic coating to intensify light. The more light that the tube is exposed to the more of this chemical is "used up". Their is a protective layer of 'film' that protects this coating on Gen 2 and Gen 3 tubes, on Gen 4 or FLAG (filmless autogated) tubes their is no protective film which results in a VERY short lifespan of the tube. The life span of the tube is based on clinical conditions, and when your life span is up it doesn't mean the unit stops working. It means that the image and amount of light that can be intensified is reduced. A gen 3 tube at 40,000 hrs of use will give you a poor image probably comparable to gen 1, while a Gen 1 unit will just be functionally useless.
Q: How do you aim down sites with NVG?
A: You can't physically do it unless its weapon mounted. Which leads us to the question regarding optics.
Q: What optics to use with weapon mounted NV?
A: A quality NV compatible one of course. I have seen many NVGs with burned out spots caused from rifle scopes, red dots that are illuminated. They have a dark ring, chevron, cross hair, or dot that is completely black in the image. At the moment the only real options are genuine military grade optics such as Eotech, Aimpoint. Budget lines like Vortex does have a NV setting but it's really damn bright. So bright that it washes out the NV, Actually, my VIPER PST was so bright under the lowest NV setting that it could have been used as a IR flashlight. I wish i kept the pictures because it looked like a lightsabre under NV. The best budget option is a Genuine Aimpoint PRO ~$350.00.
Q: What is Signal to noise mean?
A: Simply put signal to noise (StN) is "static" that you get from the tube when you crank up our gain or are amplifying light. In this picture below you can see some white artifacts in the image. This comes from static in the image like the old bunny ear TVs. Picture taken with a Cell phone and by pressing the optical sensor to the NV. It's a fucking awful way to take images and it makes NV images look terrible. I need to buy a camera adapter for my Canon(s)

: What about IR light?
A: If you are running digital NV you will need IR light. Most of the time units will have built in IR illumination of some kind. But on cloudy days with no moon you will need a IR light if you are running anything other than a Gen 3 OMNI VII unit. Chinese knock off IR flashlights can get the job done. You can hack the lights to provide a smooth and even spread of light comparable to quality IR flashlights, However military grade IR flashlights are far better, and the cost is relatively cheap on the used market ~150-250 dollars. I recommend that you keep the power of the IR light to <150mw of power non coherent light (non-laser) as it is safe to shine at people, the power recommendation is to balance the life span of your NODS with the quality of image. Their is a VERY good reason why the US military issued flashlight (m952v) has a max output of ~120mw of IR light. Remember their is some bleed through on the light wavelengths. You can see visible faint red hue from a IR flashlights, the Surefire m952v does have this red hue as well but it's the smallest and viewable only under specific angles and distances. By far the most effective at reducing the red glow of any IR light I have used.
People running higher end NV will see IR light, using IR light paints you out like a light house. This actually isn't a very big deal if the event is planned well. On a half moon or better No NVG is actually better than running a low to mid grade Gen 2 unit. Their is generally enough light for everyone to see even on a cloudy night with half moon. If their are dozens of people running Gen 1, or Gen 2 NVG then their will be so much IR output that it won't even matter, and their are strategies to prevent being picked on by higher end NV users.
Q: So what about lasers for aiming?
A: Lasers give away your position. Ideally....
1. Flood with IR illumination so you can walk your BBs onto target; or
2. Have a properly dialed in IR laser so you have a vague idea what you are aiming at
3. Be a skilled shooter
Lasers:
Big controversy here. different clubs, games, provinces have different rules. And IR lasers are a very, very controversial subject.
FACTS:
IR lasers shone to the eyes will cause permanent blind spots and/or blindness
They do not cause a blink reflex as the beam is not visible.
It is more expensive to engineer a low power IR laser than a high power one.
"EYE SAFE" by military standards (training) is 0.7mw. Zero point seven milliwatts
It is highly recommended that Live fire pistols use a IR laser no more powerful than 0.1 mw. Zero point one milliwatts
BB's do not follow a straight path like a real bullet does.
Chinese knockoffs have power ratings between 3mw to 50mw. The lasers on these units shine a 'dot' or point that grows as the distance increases. This is because of poor focusing mechanisms on the laser, and bleeding of the frequency of light transmitted. A nail head sized dot at 50 ft becomes a dinner plate sized 'dot' at 150ft, etc. You can easily shine a dinner plate sized 'dot' onto someone's face and permanently blind them.
Q: When someone shines a flashlight at you does it flare?
A: Short answer, not on nice units. Long answer read this: NIGHT VISION GENERATION COMPARSION, keep in mind that the camera is causing a lot of the bright spots in the linked pictures. The image that you see with the naked eye is much nicer
Q: Everyone at "X" game has Gen 3 I don't wanna play against them..... WAAAH :BABY FACE:
A: Go to training days and learn how to work around it and defeat the systems. Learn how to see the systems in the dark (yes, NVG is visible to the naked eye at dark). I didn't have quality NV until 2013 and i've been playing for almost 25 years. Learn to use a flashlight effectively, also it takes dedicated training to operate with NV effectively. It does take LOTS of practice to walk up a flight of stairs using NV, let alone wandering around in the bush or urban environment. At the largest games in Alberta, you can expect to see 10 people running some kind of NV out of 150 or so players.
Q: Can I make it myself?
A: Technically yes, You can make the systems yourself if you are capable of soldering at a skilled level, and have access to clean room to nitrogen purge the unit and do the soldering and assembly in. Digital NV you can make on your own from parts you get from ALIEXPRESS. Basically short of the housing it can run you around 100-150 dollars to build a digital PVS 14 clone equivalent that the airsoft websites sell.
Q: Can I upgrade my system with better image intensifiers?
A: Short answer no. Long answer basically no. If you bought a genuine NVD then you could replace the tubes with the same specification tubes of higher quality. The issue is going back to the last question of making the system yourself. It's rather common to see binocular setups that are disassembled to create two monocles. The binocular housing is then sold off.
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__________________
Do you know what ruins airsoft?
(Chair), (Drama), (Air), (Sugar) softers, filthy casuals
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mcguyver
it would appear I am not first up in this gang-bang
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WANTED PTW Receiver PRIME, STG, Factory
Last edited by Azathoth; November 10th, 2016 at 16:49..
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