Jesus Hates A Quitter...
 

Okay, what the fuck...

Over the past several months I heard rumors & rumors of rumors of long time airsoft players "retiring" from the sport/hobby, or what ever the hell we're calling it this week. I've heard & read a number of reasons ranging from this, that to the other thing, but to be honest... it reeks of complete & total CRAP.

Hey, if I'm wrong, feel free to point the finger...

I just want to know what the hell's going on & why we (read:the sport, hobby, or what ever the hell we're calling it this week) are starting to hemmorage long time, experienced players. What started out as a slow bleed is turning into a gusher.

Anybody care to step up & explain this to me.

http://www.colinfahey.com/funny_imag..._followers.jpg

Who are these players in these rumors?

and i tough it was harder to quit airsoft than smoking cigarettes...

They have lives...same reason i haven't been to a game in about two months. Hell if they have other commitments then fine, so be it. Don't complain because they don't want to play any more...

....that ill happen

It's not so much that they are leaving the sport. I think they are just taking a break.

Airsoft gear is a pretty good investment. I know when I left WP I shed ALLOT of gear, and now only have my primary and a core set of gear that is dual use. SO if someone is going to back away from AS for a while, or has found another hobby to get into, you can liquidate fairly quickly, and a getting out of the sport sale is a great tag line to attract buyers, whether you are or not.

I thought about getting out of airsoft completely, but I do still have time, even with a full time job and a reserve commitment. But it's just not enough to time to be a part of and contribute to a team. Teams are a give and take, and I found I was doing more taking than giving.

There is a level of politics both at the team and the entire sport levels that grates on some people. I know the overall "grey legality" of airsoft has affected me, since I own and shoot real firearms and am worried how this activity might affect that.

We may lose some payers completely, but I think this is more of a natural reorganization than the activity dying out.

I'll call it like I see it....

Maybe (some of) us long-time players are getting sick and tired of having demands dumped on us by the "me first" mentality of the 15-21 year-old crowd who feel that since we are experienced that we are somehow obligated to help them out? I've noticed that new players expect us to bend over backwards and meet their needs while only offering the excuse that if we don't kiss their ass, "the sport is going to die".

That's not the airsoft community we created in this country - as I remember it, ours was a community with a DIY/self-reliant attitude where only the strong and intelligent flourished and the weak, stupid, dishonorable, and unable-to-research-for-themselves got flamed into oblivion with no mercy or regrets. Back in the days of the old "camo" ASC when Primus ran the show by himself, 70% of this current board would have been run off with their tail between their legs from the incessant (and, in many cases, not undeserved) flaming they would attract. It might not have been the most polite and politically-correct way to run a discussion board, but no one who was around at the time would argue that it wasn't damn effective at keeping the morons out.

I remember when I started out back in '99....there were only something like 8 or 10 guys in all of Manitoba who had airsoft guns, and we played with no velocity limits - it was a "run what ya brung" mentality. If we wanted to play with more than a dozen people or so, we had to drive to Regina or fly to Ontario. We had guys running M150's and 10.8 volts, fingers getting broken and teeth getting knocked out...but we never had to worry about cheating/overshooting or flaked buy/sell deals because we all knew one another by actual names, not just by internet aliases, and in a community that tight, your reputation and honor was everything. Nowadays there are so many local players I can't keep track of them all; I've noticed questionable behavior is on the rise, as there is less accountability in the community when you are (basically) anonymous.

Here's another addition to Blackthorne's commentary - most of the old timers also hold a PAL or R-PAL. That means they have 2 expensive hobbies. One of them (airsoft), has become rife with obnoxious, self-centered, holier-than-thou teens who believe they are the future and demand to be spoonfed at every opportunity and are unwilling to do things themselves and learn the hard way (through failure). The other (target shooting/IPDA/ISPC) is filled with (comparatively) mature folks generally over the age of 25 whom they can better relate to. Ask yourself, as a mature adult, whether you would want to hang around with kids literally half your age with whom you have virtually nothing in common, or adults your own age with similar life experience, careers, vision, problems, etc.? I'm not trying to brag, but for the sake of clarity, I'm 35, married, have an 18-year-old son, a couple of university degrees, a white-collar career, a mortgage, etc. What do I have in common with a single 18-year-old who just graduated high school, works retail and lives in their mom's basement? Not much.....

I think Blackthorne's right - we're simply witnessing the end of one era and the beginning of another. The leaders of the past are moving on to other pastures for a variety of reasons, and the younger players are stepping up and taking stewardship of the hobby, for better or worse. Call it evolution if you will, but one thing is certain.

Airsoft is not going to go back to what it was 5 years ago.

Some people just outgrow dressing up and playing with toy guns.
Family, work, other hobbies and the changing community can easily turn people away from the game.
Skruface summed it all up.

Has ASC really moved that far from that? After all, the majority of people here are raised on the flaming ASC mentality and have ran the gauntlet themselves. The response mixture towards newbies still seem predominately DIY, though there's an equal or sometimes greater part of pseudoflame ("We're charging our flaaaaame"), with the more conciliatory replies coming in last.

The "retirement" of Greylocks has certainly changed that mix, though, due to the sheer volume he could generate directly ("Read the FAQ") and perhaps even more so, indirectly ("LoLz Grey's gonna get ya"). :rolleyes: But I think we're still keeping our 70% annual quota.

As for the "Me first" mentality, I certainly don't believe that we're obligated to help out people who post first and read later and I'm not sure some of them believe it either (ie. they're just in over their head). I do believe that it'd be a good thing if we don't piss off people who can always just turn around and smear airsoft as a whole in Canada by using clearsoft irresponsibly. That, and I know there are the occasional salvagable person among the askers.

Many are sick of the BS attitudes that prevail the forums as much as the fields. The overall attitude of airsoft has changed into something more infantile, more about social positioning and less about the fun of the game.

That is not true at all

Wrong. When was the last time you were at a game?

Last weekend =]

I go every weekend I can

when was the last game you went to?

I think you need to realise that some of us are basing this opinion on many years of playing airsoft. The change is unfortunate...but it is true.

coming from a region where were lucky to have 30 guys playing I even noticed a shift. When I was much smaller we had 7-10 people max at games. And as skruface said it was a bring what you go style game. We would play milsim games and balance teams based on how well certain people did. some people left the sport others moved away then I took a 5 year vacation and played paintball. Fast forward to now. Games are filled with paintsofters (people who only want to blow a bag of bb's and constantly be shooting) These sort of games have little to no interest for me. So I am kinda sitting back working on restoring some classic guns. I still plan to game but on the whole its not the same as it was years ago. As weird as it seems I am totally against minors playing when I started as a minor. Hopefully when I finish switching my collection to the guns I used to play with I can get some more fun in the game.

Oh yeah? Where?

Couple weeks back. I don't go every weekend, since I do the real thing every day at work :P

And you guys are arguing what? That your worthiness as an airsofter is based on how many games you goto?


Airsoft attracts an odd group of people.

Midway Paintball in Duncan I play with the CIA im not on there team but I play with them

Get Back On Topic!

http://www.jonco48.com/blog/nice_20doggy.jpg

i think some of the older players have to get some of the n00bitis off there chest. I really havent payed attention to older players leaving, examples?

Ive only noticed airsfot picking up steam from the last 2 years of me being a part of it. Alot of newer players are becoming the older ones now.

since i started airsoft 2 years ago (i now not long) between my first read of ASC to know I've noticed a huge change of the player base. i do think skruface is right that new guys seem to think they should have every thing fed to them, some players come on here with a legit question that shows they have some understanding of airsoft well the other 9 outa 10 new faces have questions so easy that if they read anything they could have gotten there answer.

but on the flip side i have seen on my local board JOC that the on field and bored attitude are much the same we're a no bull shit group theres not much room for error but we're still friendly its like locally not much as changed but here on ASC its a down word spin.

i just hope that airsoft Canada is in just a low point in its life but soon shit will get figured out.

P.S what did happen to grey anyways?

I'd be a lot more concerned about the seemingly inevitable stop of all airsoft gun imports into Canada and the potential for zero airsoft population growth. We'll have far more trouble with retention if the community seems no longer viable, vibrant, etc.

And I really don't know what this complain about "new guys who want to be spoonfed" and the downward spiral of ASC is about. The whole ASC mentality is devoted to making sure those who want to be spoonfed never reach the "new player" stage. Those who can't quickly transition from asking to self-sufficiency don't get into the sport due to their own cluelessness and are never members of the community. They're the same annoying percentage of visitors we get every year asking the same annoying questions.

Yeah, that explains it all right there...

Skruface has the majority of the reasons in one post. If you're going to sum it up, read his.

Being around for the launch of ASC, and the world before it... I can tell you right now that 90% of the people on this board would have been ripped several new assholes. That INCLUDES the one's who spend most of their time ripping people new assholes.

The discussions on the boards centered COMPLETELY around actual issues and it involved people who actually knew what they were talking about. All were self taught, and all had real information to share. They also didn't tollerate people who were unwilling to do any work for themselves. It's an odd paradox that despite the vast increase of available information online, we continue to get more and more people unwilling to read any of it.

Anyways. This can be attributed to an increasing number of players (bigger player base, by necessity a larger number of idiots), but it gets tiresome.

Bleh, I wrote this long post and then decided fuck it, I didn't want to post it.

Its simple. Too many drama queens, too much BS, too much cheating. I have too little time in my life for all that.

During a grenade building exercize in which we had 7 guys making 100 grenades, one of us questioned 3 hours in what the **** are we doing (spending a beautiful day indoors making grenades out of fireworks for a pretend soldier game) and then proceeded to ask if any of us have a girlfriend to which we mumbled no. It got me thinking and I can see why some people eventually call it quits

Not me though.. not just yet :)

:D lol

Lets be clear (Saint hit on it) that those noobs that drive us nuts here very rarely go out to the games we go to.

I do see a disturbing trend away from fundamental MilSim core beliefs and basics by the younger players coming in (read: noobs who actually PLAY).

I think it's less about THE GAME for them, and more about the GUNS and GEAR, which is a real shame. I agree we are playing dress up, but the opportunity to immerse yourself, just a bit, and learn some tactics and techniques that will make the game better for everyone, a more interesting experience, seem to be unimportant to the newer airsoft player. I won't get into why I think this is. That would be a long commentary on teens of today and I won't waste anyones time rehashing a well known point of view.

And as much as I prefer games with no mercy rules and higher FPS restrictions, I think without the FPS restriction, we would have already adopted the paint ball "more, faster, shinier" attitude, and would have folks running around with guns akin to fire hoses.

I believe if we lose a core group of players, that are (like myself) quite happy to operate in a large game (24-48 hours) in a recce platoon and not fire a single shot, airsoft is going to be a VERY different landscape in the next 5 years.

The spirit of airsoft is in it's homage to the MILITARY. If we lose that, we are just playing paint ball, regardless of the gear we are wearing, or guns we use.

I can only speak for myself so here goes;
When our daughter (second child) was born I sold all my AEG's and GBB's because I knew that I wouldn't have time to play.
Now 2 1/2 years later I find I have SOME time to play so I'm looking around for an affordable AEG or sniper rifle.
To be honest, it will be the cost of the toys and the attitude of the players that will keep me out of the sport this time. So far the attitude seems fine. But I'll reserve judgement for now.
I don't like to borrow anyone else's guns (anyone who knows me can tell you that) so that's not really an option either.
I have a full time job, Wife, two kids, a mortgage, and I own/manage a small hobby store (D&D games and such) so time is really at a premium.
If I'm lucky I'll be able to manage one game a month. It's not much, but it's something.
And that's my 2c for what it's worth.

Sundown
EDIT After reading Blackthorn's post I remembered something that happened at the MAA's FNG day I played at; I had to re-load a high-cap mag. On my way back to load up, I thought to myself "holy crap! I'm playing like a paintballer!" So I put a handful (maybe 75) bb's in the mag and told myself to lay off the effing trigger. It worked too.
Sorry, that's a bit off topic. I consider myself well and truely flame-broiled.

Fuckin-A, I could not say it better myself.

Skuface echos the frustration of anyone who's stuck with the sport for more than 3 years and have begun to see the track repeat itself. Meta sums it up quite nicely when saying that, essentially a lot of new people are not self-propelled researchers and are followers and not do'ers. And if you don't know who I am referring to, this is precisely the point - the game is OUT THERE, not IN HERE. When interactions on a dboard begin to take precidence over the actual sport the dboards were designed to support, a lot of people leave in disgust.

Based on my own experience and with the amount of BB and battery activity I am seeing go through my hands, I would venture to say to ALL of you that what you're seeing is a pattern change, and not a shift in the actually playing numbers. If anything I would say the interest in the sport is at an all time high, but at the same time the community is more fractured than it has even been before. This means lots of small communities playing games amongst themselves that never make it to the attention of the larger community. This causes the sense of loss of players because a lot of the vets who hosted and ran large games have stopped and instead are out playing in small spec ops teams and enjoying not having to drive the bus all the time.

From my POV, I've stopped trying to open new fields and I limit myself to hosting ONE major event a year and for the rest of the year my efforts are for myself and my team and I try to go out and support the small number of hosts out there holding milsim games, as much as a show of support and brotherhood as for wanting to play an actual milsim game.

Bottom line? If you think the sport is dying, you're either spending too much time online and not enough time out meeting people and networking to get into good private games, or, (sorry to say it) you're a fucktard nobody wants to play with. Sorry but thats the unvarnished truth.

ROTFLMFBO!

Nope! No varnish on that one :D :D :D :D !

Okay, whose consider the older crew, because i see people on this forum refered to or refering them selves as the "older" players, who have been here for a shorter time than me, and i still think im very new to this sport.

I think old is 3-5+ years.....

If you had a tank of CO2 strapped to your back ( a al Poncho) ...your fucking ANCIENT.

I see all kinds of "retired" players at games all the time. It's amazing how your enjoyment of the sport goes up when you stay out of politics on the internet.

its the old chairsoft vs airsoft v5.83b thing again

iirc, the catchphrase circa 2002 on the ASC boards was "airsoft is on the field, not on the net"

but those also included the days of Sasksoft and RC...now THAT made for entertainment on the forums.

:)

Time to put that back on the front page.

Don't confuse time spent on this board for time spent playing airsoft. I myself started at the same time that Skruface did, when there was 6 guys playing and one, count em, ONE AEG in the province. (Tim's apartment and an AUG ring any bells Jaimie?).

Sundown

Ya, no kidding! We did the same one afternoon, most fun part was watching Droc write all kinds of funny stuff on each grenade, and when you pulled it out at the game, you had to yell out what it says on it when you throw it. At point someone had a grenade that read "I just saved a pile of cash by switching to Gyco!!!" LOL

Heh. I got a girlfriend FIRST, and now I'm getting into Airsoft :P.

But as to the people saying old people leaving the game, and no guns coming into Canada:
Perhaps it's a good thing some people are leaving the game, or selling off a bunch of guns because they have a kid/house/car/wife where they money could be better utilized. (They might still play the game, just have 1 or 2 AEG's) The reason for this is that if one person with 10 guns is selling them all to single people, you get 10 new people into the world of Airsoft. Now, I'm not saying all those people are mature rational people, but we can all hope

Just a thought.

That's a stopgap measure, though. At some point, the legislation will have to change in our favour, otherwise gun prices will increase to ridiculous levels. However, in the short term, it will mean that the major central source of airsoft guns in Canada becomes the age verified sections here. This will allow a little more control over who gets AEGs, although we will continue to be plagued by clearsoft until the legislation changes.

I agree. That's kind of what I meant. It's the only thing good about it right now. Like you said it's a stopgap measure.

Oh my god - it's SUNDOWN, THE 'Sundown' - holy crap man we have missed you. I swear you made everything worthwhile for me at OP:CT2 with that NATO PIG sign and the expletitives you and Skruface were shouting from the ridge. And that camo, head to toe with matching boots - I think you could hear Porkchop grumbling and turning over his grave having bested him at the 'most unique camo' event catagory.

To add anything to this thread, I think it's just as important for all of us who are on the inside to keep an open door policy for all of us (save for the one's we really don't want back), because we all know about real life, and how it changes, then changes back again. Case in point, guys like Sundown, Wyseguy - most of us KNOW these guys from what we would consider 'the good old days'. I consider these guys veterans having been a part of the changes and evolutions of this community and sport.

As far as I can say, the only thing that makes today different from what 'good old days are', is time and distance. (Thanks to the brother who shared that last part of wisdom.). We're all a part of making to today's the good old days of tomorrow.

Perspective is everything. Perspectives change. If your perspectives are not to your liking, either change it, or wait awhile until the right one comes along.

Well I can see the playing dress-up getting old but playing with guns? Come on now!

Even when I don't have time to get out and shoot my pals, the other side of this sport/hobby
is all the building/upgrading and customizing of my guns and gear.

I've noticed over the past couple years where I play the more senior players aren't regulars
anymore but fortuntely they come out once in a while to keep the youg'ins on the right path.

Hey Poncho!
How's it going man? Yeah LOL I remember that. I think we had more in camp than we did on patrol (well maybe not, I'm thinking it was 50/50). But that was the "good old days" as you say when every new AEG was cause for 8 grown men to stand around in a circle looking at it and trying to get in line to shoot a bb or five out of it "just to try it out".

As for getting back onto the subject, yeah the 'open door' policy is definitely a good thing. True there are some people that no one wants back, however, even they can change for the better. 5 years is a long time. All that the community can do is keep that door open and hope for the best.
At the very least, we can buy thier guns off of them! ;)

Oh and if Poncho and anyone else wants a blast from the past, click here;
http://www.pbase.com/aiofm/opct2
Those are the pics I took of Capital Thunder 2 when Skruface and I flew there (ah the good old days when I worked for Air Canada). Go ahead and take a peek, some fun stuff there.

Sundown

Ah, I see the experimental Czech desert camo.
That IS nice stuff.
LOL, I am actually able to fit into mine again ;)

I am still so sorry to have missed CT2. Goddam divorce!!

I've made a couple threads similar to yours awhile back... not many people responded to it and it got lost somewhere on ASC. *lol*

Airsoft IS different now than compared to a few years ago, I think Skruface, Scarecrow, Bravo, etc. summed it up pretty nicely.

What can I say? I guess I can say.... I miss playing with people like:
- Tru (yes, OMG, he used to play!)
- Quaestor
- Tomalok
- Hype
- ILLusion
- kedirken (lol, forgot about KD)
- LittleAlien (good 'ol Phoenix Connection)
- Col.Thumper
- Octane
- Kato
- That guy who we always called Kato, but isn't (LOL)
- Tharkad
- HonestJohn
- Sgt.Pepper
- Stone
- Agit-Prop
- Malinak
- Starlight

etc.

Of course, there are a lot more names, but I'm having a hard time recalling their ASC handles...I have to say it was a blast, and an honour to have met and played with them, they were an amazing group to play with. I'm sure anyone who's played with them in the past can attest - the atmosphere of the games were very different.

I'm still glad to see some of the others out, like Meta, DragonHawk, Poncho (sometimes), SINN, Slick, Memel, Pvt. Ivan (Kameradshadt in general), Sha Do, Barf, Scarecrow, Morb, etc.

Actually, I also miss some of the classic ASC retards that have come and gone, like SKY, Tech Support, scott_ ..... needless to say, they got blacklisted fairly quickly.

Aside from some of the local Chicken Slaughter events, I can't remember any recent social ASC meets. With the amount of new players (and n00bs), this game of ours is also becoming less personal. I try to meet the new players when I'm out, but it's getting pretty hard to put names to faces now.

I'm not as active in airsoft as before, mainly due to time and personal life. Mortgages, insurance, upcoming wedding, stupid rock that cost more than it's worth (lol), car, etc. I try to make it out whenever I can though...

I miss big scenario games, CT would've been great - but I couldn't make it and I missed out on some serious fun. =\ I miss the Wolfpack games up in Muskoka, although I know they still run games (and there was one recently) ... I miss the ability to have the time to attend those games.

Then again... maybe I'm just getting old and lazy, and holding on to those glory days when I could still run.

Dude, LT_poncho or Aqua isnt there!

Aqua is in Sask. and Poncho is included (Im hoping Im in that etc Peter or is the love gone already?)

Not to boast, but I kinda see our team as a middle ground between newer players and the old (9/11 of us have been playing for 3 years+)

Nothing wrong with Noobs though. When I started, all I wanted to do was to run around aimlessly boom-headshotting people. Eventually I grew into liking mixed-pace Milsim. Same will happen for others who stay in the game. Overall, Ill have to disagree with Phal, Bravo etc. and say that the game is the same as I remember it 2 years ago and most of the best Milsim minded players have remained, although they play/host a lot less now

Oh i thought you were listing what you thought were the older players. my bad : |

lol "ASC Retards". Who was that clown before Serpentor, the one who almost got lynched...

Well, my list was basically a list of more senior (local) players... Poncho is on the bottom list, as I still see him out once in awhile. And yeah, I was listing local players - I've never played with Aquamarine, but from what I've heard, I'm sure he's a real a-hole. ;)

As for Koopa, yeah, never really liked you. You're a bully. Mil-sim crowd is still around, when you look for it. But that's also because you mainly go to those type of games and are not out for more of the regular games.

And I have to disagree with you on this:
It should be, "nothing wrong with new players..."

n00bs are a different breed, they need to stay away.

Phalanix, I think its just a sign of the times. Airsoft has been thrust into a different place over the past year, and is struggling with growing pains. Overall, airsoft has always fallowed the same lines, but it bounces around now and then.
Like I said, with crapsoft and clearsoft moving in like the plague, minors running rampant and airsoft struggling with the law more now then ever...combined with regular life changes, its expected to see these kinds of changes in the player base.
ah well

this may be a regional issue as I know in calgary we are moving away from the painball style skrim games. We are coming up with more and more airsoft fields; not paintball fields that let us play there. Every month we have 2 or more milsims. I think since I started a couple of years ago things are getting better out here. But we have no tolerance for asshats and I think JOC has made huge strides in progressions of the sport. We have several new teams that really have their shit together. These teams have learnt from vet teams if you want to be effective you need to study military tactics and practice as a team. Therefore a lot of the players out here that are fuck ups learn real quick that it really sucks spending 8+ hours in the field by themselves out of the objective based action becuase they can't be trusted. Ussually you see a turn around in 2 games.

I am sorry for you guys that are feeling things are going south and I can see how you may. Move to the promised land and we will accept you with open arms.

I thought he was too - so far i've taken a few 'old man' hits, and Phalanx is busting my balls for not making it out enough. Buddy, Peter, strawberry,...now that Flag Raiders have ok'ed tac-goggles when Paintballers are not around - i'll want to hit the place.

I don't mean to not make games, even for the one's I flake on. I got two kids that come before me everytime, and all I can do is try to better manage my schedule. I hate missing games.

He's hates missing games, but he loves fucking me silly instead.

Sorry guys, I'M why the old timers aren't coming to games, I've just got a thing for grey pubes.

KG3, lol... now I'm getting a picture of a puking person. We really ought to stop linking pictures from whichever site that is... unless you were actually linking to a picture of someone puking.

Edit: oh wait, you were linking to an actual photo of someone puking.. lol, k... just gonna remove it, thanks. <3

Wayne - lol, not busting your balls... just saying how we miss you! ;) Didn't know Joe ok'd the use of tactical goggles when pballers aren't around... that's great news!

OMG.... how did I forget PropScam?! lol...

No no, the puking person was intentional, considering the context of the post prior to it.

I don't see that in Ottawa region.
Stalker is getting older and older.
Hazard is more ugly everyday goes on !
Apoc's dogs and WARGO just getting bigger and bigger .
Droc's finger just get shorter and shorter.
Testtube just became a "bastard"
Fox moves slower and slower.
Gamez's girlfriend is hoter and hoter !
Pantless Crab taking more pictures.
Qutantis just have more toys everyday!
Dirty deeds still got problem my taste on women.

Well ! there are also lots Quebec players who don't really post but they still very active in the field.

2 years in the sport nothing change much ! Same steady crews but just more connection with Quebec. Beware of the Quebec players, they talk their tatic in French.

I don't know if I count, but I do my best here in Quebec.
Don't forget Bruce, Raven, Vondnik, the Salamander Boys, etc...

I think it's safe to say that Savage Harris' concerns are safely put to bed...

What about the oldest and most "experienced" of them all. Greylocks? Old news but hes claimed to be in this shit more than any of us.

Tee hee hee.... Poncho said "bed"...

3 years and 2 days for me on asc (shortly after i first joined I went to deadlands for the first time)

Now I'm stupider and broker.

I remember Greylocks first game was in Kingston, at the Mecca of Airsoft - Salamander Field - must have been 1999 or so.
Actually, it wasn't his first game, because I think the first time he came down he just wanted to see a game/be a part of it. He was sick with the flu at the time so everyone was just...ummm - you stay over there. He came out with his buddy from MarStar - ArcticFox - and I think they were the only ones with full DPM at the game.
He bought his first gun from AMC/Autowings in Pacific Mall and boy did he get a fucked up gun.
I doubt he would be considered a pre-internet player/member.

Oh the days of Kingston. Our crew really miss those days. The only thing as good as a game at Kingston was the BBQ at Mouse's place afterward.

ha ha ! Bruce !! ha ha ! he is just the most funny guy ever.
I heard that most Quebec players have their own French version of ASC, so they are not here as often as we are .

What GL claims and what the truth really is on a lot of shit are 2 totally different things...

Bring back Kingston!!!

There was a post last year from Meta about having a game where the requirement was to have been a member of ASC before a certain date. Whatever happened to that idea? We should do that. . . there are several of us that still have our stuff and would totally play if able. One of the things Treadstone and I were talking about is that, if we were to go to one of the current games, we wouldn't really know anyone anymore.

KD

That seems like a Exclusive Clique dick thing to do, i mean if its friends wanting to do a game, or an old buddy get together and its private, than i dont see how its different than anything else, but if its like a standard thing to have this "join date prerequisite" all your doing is alienating potential players. Thats not fair to people who dont suck.

Ok, but at least it's not communist, either.

I hear ya but really I dont mind. I mean Im a year off from being able to play in that game but the reason the game is being held is that they (geezers ASers) dont go to other games. So this may entice them to come back. Also, it was gonna be a regular game skirmish, nothing special except for retro camo. There are about 30 games per year like that one in Ontario

It was a bad idea that died an appropriate death. There are many good players who don't even get on the dboards, let alone ASC. Then there are others that are not allowed on this board anymore who are otherwise appealing to have at a game. No offence to Hojo or the other mods but to restrict a game to those who maintain membership on this board is putting tremendous power in a place that has proven to be fickle and not always fair or right. I wouldn't trust the membership system here to do anything but enforce the clique that already exists here - this would exclude potentially good players from games that they would otherwise attend and become known at.

While Scarecrow make a good point, I don't think it was going to be limited to ASC membership only. There are a lot of good players that aren't on here (or at least anymore) and I'm sure word of mouth would've been past on. Or maybe I misunderstood what Jay was saying..?

But the thing is, back then the community was smaller - and locally, you would see the regulars at just about every airsoft game. Just about everyone got along, and a lot of us became friends over airsoft. The atmosphere back then was different, a lot of us seemed to have bonded a certain way. So that game we were going to have was really sort of a reunion type thing. And really, I consider all those people friends - even though not close friends (some), but friends nevertheless. I really don't think it was about "oh, I joined earlier than you so I can play - ha ha - in your face". There were (and are) a lot of great players that are new(er), and really, if the game had gone through, I don't think they would've been rejected. It was a ploy to get the "old regulars" out again for a day of gaming. It's not a regular thing that we do locally. There are still a number of older players out and about, they just don't show up as regulars like before.

There are a lot of new players in airsoft now and it's getting harder to get to know them, especially when they don't show up to games regularly. I try to meet the new players when at games, but I don't like talking much in person, so I'm usually pretty quiet. I let DeathSniper or Zeon do the talking.. lol They like to talk...

I had a guy (I think it was Havoc) say to me at a game recently, "OMG, you talk? I thought you didn't speak English... I never see you talking." LOL

AS out east most be really different then whats out west.

i rarely see any of the problems here in Alberta as you guys in ON i may have to attend a game out east to see if there are any differences.

It should almost be a fucking requirement for players to wear name tapes, at least in the safe zone, to bring some kind of accountability back. 5-6 years ago, if someone did someone stupid everyone knew who they were and what happened. These days, when someone does something dumb, doesn't call hits, or whatnot, it's always "Some guy. I don't know him".

Sure dude, but I think we have a bigger player base out here. It's a numbers game; even at 1%, more players means more idiots.

well i dunno honestly know how many people play airsoft in Alberta or Calgary im sure theres a larger player base out there.

but here in Calgary we have a large regular player base. i personally go under for the winter with and a job i stay under I'll go to a game here and there but not all the time summer is when i play every chance i get.

but i just want to see how AS is played out in ON and QUE to see if there is a difference.

We used to have a mainstay of regulars at games... but recent years yeilded things differently. Before, I could name just about every face I see at games (other than that guy that looked like Kato) - I can't say the same now. *lol*

I am 20, and a new player. Quite honestly, I find it ridiculous that there are so many issues with the "newbies". I mean cummon guys it's a game that requires honesty and fairness, much like any other sport/group hobby. I try to be as open and honest with myself and others as I can be. If you get hit, who cares. Call it, and get some water at your respawn. I don't understand why this bullshit macho "I am god's gift" attitude exists. Like in any other branch of activities, those who have this attitude never get very far.

As for Skruface's comment at the beginning of this thread, I sympothize with you. Finding things out for ourselves is what makes us informed, educated players. I'm just trying to say that in the end, it feels better for you, and probably everyone else if you stick it out and solve the problems yourself. That's not to say that a little guidance isn't appreciated, but don't be fooled into thinking that everyone is going to hand over a complete step by step guide to the sport/hobby.

So as for all the new guys reading this, please: try it yourself first, call your hits, and remember ... stay low and stay fast.

I agree. If I came on here way back when I joined the sport, and asked a shit load of questions, I would have been "useless" at a team level and a player level. Granted I created this account to ask a simple question and to do things my self. And that simple question had no answer but from the experenced with it. (wiregages)

Hate to say it I miss graylocks. He was so mean and nasty and kept the idots that didnt do their homework at bay. Then let the nice responcible 15-18 year olds stay unharmed and almost protected those select individuals.

At some point you have to draw the line between a constructive kick in the ass and someone just using this venue as a way to rage at people. At a certain point Greylock's posts were so predictable you didn't need Greylocks anymore... in fact, I don't believe in Greylocks, I think he was an ASC bot that went viral and infected the board... it would explain the omniprescence thing anyways.

Oh okay. I thought you meant exactly what was posted and that was to use the membership system here as a game signup and restrictive mechanism, ie: you don't have an ASC account or your banned, you don't play. If thats not what was meant then I misunderstood.

The idea of having a central system for game hosting has always appealed to me, however, I think it would have to be independent of a dboard and its politics. I am not against banning certain kinds of people from games for unsanctioned behavior (far from it, witness the latest problem at one of our games that came out a week later), I just would want it to be based on unsafe or a violation of communally agreed to rules. OASA was an attempt to do that to some degree and it got support but I then gave up on it after a rather noobish incident with a bunch of noobs that torpedo'd a summer's worth of work for me - and yes, I am still very bitter about that one and I won't let it go no matter how much of a broken record I sound like.

However, Phalanix, if your goal is a reunion of sorts, hold just that. But you'd have to plan it plenty in advance and make it appealing enough for people who've gone lukewarm on the sport to want to come to it - part of the reason many are not around is simply that their interest has waned over time. Not much you can do about that. I often meet old players over beers totally outside of airsoft and we often enjoy a 'you remember when' moment, so for those who I really enjoyed the company of they are always a phone call away and I have yet to have someone tell me they're not interested in having a beer one afternoon.

True I agree some best events I been to were hosted by the PQAC.

I'd like to see a big come back from that neck of the woods.
STORM MOUNTAIN !!

But like it's been said in many post above. Life, responsibilities, shifts in interests or priorities, health.

What skruface posted at the beginning is the airsoft I wanted to get into (Still waitin gon my first AEG). I've researched the sport for more than three years now, often reading things twice and had a long hard though process as to which AEG to get. I still consider myself a noob (as I have yet to attend a game), but I'd hope it's not what skruface described in that post.

From the sounds of it, this new era of Airsoft has an attitude far too close to that of paintball (but when it's kids...well it's kind of obvious it'll be that way).

+10

Lulz.. If you think thats the case your sorely mistaken.

People's lives change and thier priorities change with them, but moreso Im not seeing a mass exodus from the sport just a little bit of the backing away from the interwebs side of the community.

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

holy shit tom posted
run to the fucking hills!
but anywho; I've got to admit. back when I played on WAR, you knew everyone that you were playing with. I went out last year, I think I knew what? six, maybe seven faces out of the thirty + guys that showed up? whenever I showed up to FR games that is. it personally takes alot for me to start talking to someone. I tend to get annoyed by stupid people very quickly.
as well; I've tended to notice this alot more over the last two years. when someone that has a join date earlier or a bit after mine generally says they're attending a game; they're actually going to fucking attend and not bail because of some bullshit that you should have very well known was going to occur WEEKS ahead of time.
now I know I"m not one to make very many games. in fact, this year alone I've probably played more games then I had in the two previous years combined. but when I do say I'm going to make it to a game, I will make it.
but anywho; all the guys that have serious legit posts in here have pretty much said everything and I feel no need to repeat.

Wow, I made the list at #2 after Tru? I'm so moved! I miss you too Peter!!!

BTW, this thread has convinced me to quit too. I feel like moving to California. I wonder if they have any airsoft fields there.

this thread has convinced me that this is a thread. I didn't know what it was at first. Letters turning into words with punctuation making up sentences, the whole thing was just scary at first.

Seriously though people grow change and evolve. Yep there are new players out there and I hardly know most of the old players. Wish I did cuz you get some real cool stories. On the subjects of older players gone MIA where's our friend FRANKLIN HA? I know a few people who owe him something.
Hope to meet every one some day. especialy you SCARECROW!

I know we already met but it was my only wizard of Oz refrence.

let's play

Sigh, and I didn't even get an honourable mention.

Wah.

I'm going to go listen to Linkin Park.

KD

check page 4, yay LP

How could this happen to me!!!
/emo

holy shit KD, Prop, and Tru posting on the same page?
did I get into my standard issued time machine and I'm back in 02 now?

Who the hell is 'Tru'?

he's from back when airsoft was glorious....

Some sort of sushi I think.... really expensive sushi...